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Respect not conversion

July 16, 2024

We shall begin our consideration of Mary on this page with both a caution and an encouragement …!

Any evaluation of Catholic Church teaching presupposes some knowledge of the subject, but apparently such knowledge is not always there. The eminent Protestant scholar, Adolf von Harnack deplored the ignorance of the majority of Protestant theology graduates about Catholicism:

 http://www.scribd.com/doc/93104880/Gerald-O-Collins-Catholicism-The-Story-of-Catholic-Christianity

“I am convinced from constant experience of the fact that the students who leave our schools have the most disconnected and absurd ideas about ecclesiastical history. Some of them know something about Gnosticism, or about other curious and for them worthless details. But of the Catholic Church, the greatest religious and political creation known to history, they know absolutely nothing, and they indulge in its regard in wholly trivial, vague, and often directly nonsensical notions. How her greatest institutions originated, what they mean in the life of the Church, how easily they may be misconceived, and why they function so surely and impressively: all this, according to my experience, is for them, apart from a few exceptions, a terra incognita [an unknown land].”

So please allow us to encourage everyone reading this to be curious about what the Catholic Church teaches about Mary, and also to recognise that those beliefs are made with reference to the Holy Scriptures – the inspired Word of God. It was Cardinal Ratzinger – later Pope Benedict XVI – who wrote that “dogma is by definition nothing other than an interpretation of Scripture”


A Loving Caution


There may also, be those who are more closed minded in their opinion of the Catholic Church and will not hear anything that justifies it or undoes confusion about their teachings for whatever reason. To such people we must consider the Scripture:


“Fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom” Proverbs.9:10

And to facilitate such healthy ‘fear of the Lord’, there are two very serious points to be made to all Christians who resist Church Unity:-


1. A False Balance – A Caution


Reformed Protestants hold as one of their distinguishing measures, the right of every Christian believer to read and interpret the Bible, trusting that the Holy Spirit will guide the individual. There are tens of thousands of Christian denominations in the world and the typical Protestant will hold in an attitude of respect and recognition as brothers and sisters, virtually all those diverse “Bible-believing” denominations. The reason for this, is that Protestants respect the fact that the Holy Spirit may well have led ‘x’ and ‘y’ as individuals and Churches in a particular emphasis or interpretation of respective Scripture verses, according to His Sovereign purposes – even if those different interpretations differ from each other. Well, the Catholic Church is a ‘Bible–believing Church’ too; in fact strictly speaking the Bible is a Catholic book.


While the Catholic Church does not formally recognise the right of private interpretation of Scripture, it does when many individual views of Catholics are considered collectively as the Sensus Fidelium (Sense of the Faithful).
However, an observation may be levelled against the Protestant Churches and most Protestants, of using ‘unfair weights’ or a ‘false scales’ to apply one measure of judgement to a Protestant Church (or individual) who may disagree with them …. And a very different measure is applied when considering the Catholic Church, which seems judged to be not allowed to have its own interpretation of Scripture under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
This despite the Roman Catholic Church being the original historical Church dating back 2000 years to Jesus and the parent Church of the Reformed Churches, who are, (with the Orthodox Churches, who also separated over Scripture interpretation), virtually its children.


By such double standards – being applied in such a way as to divide the Christian Church - well intentioned Christians are doing the work of the Accuser - and God abhors this (See the Judgement of the Stumbling Blocks below):


Proverbs 11:1 'A false balance is an abomination to the LORD, but an accurate weight is his delight.'

Proverbs 20:23 'Diverse and deceitful weights are shamefully vile and abhorrent to the Lord, and false scales are not good'. (AMP)


Matthew 7:1-3 'Do not judge, so that you may not be judged. For with the judgement you make you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get. Why do you see the speck in your neighbour's eye, but do not notice the log in your own eye? 


A Loving Caution for Catholics Too


Whereas Protestants may have applied the measuring scales of Scripture Interpretation unfairly to compare themselves and the Catholic Church, so also many Catholics appear overly confident in the fact that their Church dates back to the time of Jesus and that our Protestant brothers and sisters do not have the fullness of the revelation in their practice of faith. However, since Catholics realise that they have more opportunity to receive Grace in the Sacraments and other aspects, there is also a price to pay and God will hold us more to account for our actions than others:


Luke 12:47,48 'That slave who knew what his master wanted, but did not prepare himself or do what was wanted, will receive a severe beating. But one who did not know and did what deserved a beating will receive a light beating. From everyone to whom much has been given, much will be required'


The Catholic Church’s desire for a single and unifying interpretation of the Bible is surely commendable to observers and rather than allowing hurried personal interpretations, their learned and rigorous interpretation of the Bible is strengthened by the meticulous study of such interpretations demonstrated by witnesses and teachers of the Early Church – the ‘Fathers’ of the Church; and also the (not casual but rigorously tested and discerned) guidance of the Holy Spirit in history called Sacred Tradition (capital ‘T’ – different from human tradition). Such historical prudence and academic rigour clearly demonstrates Catholic intellectual integrity for Biblical interpretation.


It was Cardinal Ratzinger – later Pope Benedict XVI – who wrote that “dogma is by definition nothing other than an interpretation of Scripture”


For a Time Such As This - God is Uniting His Church


Evidently the whole Christian Church is weak and under concerted attack at present, and the biggest scandal in World history still remains this division of the Christian Church. Yet Jesus prophesied that all Christians would be united – in such a way that all the world would believe in Him.


John 17:21 ' that they may all be one. As you, Father, are in me and I am in you, may they also be in us, so that the world may believe that you have sent me.'


God desires to unite His Church, both according to Scriptures and also several recent prophecies given through credible mouthpieces to this generation.


Prophecy – God speaks


Whether individuals are comfortable with prophecy in these times or not – God is very comfortable with it, and if He can even speak through a donkey (Numbers 22:28), would He remain silent with billions of souls headed for damnation in these times? Really - would He?


Luke 19:39,40 'Some of the Pharisees in the crowd said to him, 'Teacher, order your disciples to stop.'  He answered, 'I tell you, if these were silent, the stones would shout out.'


Also for those who despise prophecy we must recall the reference in Malachi to the spirit of prophecy, which Elijah represents, returning in the Last Days to convert men’s hearts.


Malachi 4:5,6 'Lo, I will send you the prophet Elijah before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes. He will turn the hearts of parents to their children and the hearts of children to their parents, so that I will not come and strike the land with a curse.'


Let us consider some prophecies referring to these times, which especially refer to Unity amongst Christians:


The Great Revival - Smith Wigglesworth 1947


The following is an end time “rare” prophecy given by Smith Wigglesworth in 1947, two weeks before his death. Wigglesworth had a profound ministry of signs and wonders.


Smith Wigglesworth

“Two Distinct Moves
During the next few decades there will be two distinct moves of the Holy Spirit, across the church in Great Britain. The first move will affect every church that is open to receive it and will be characterized by a restoration of the baptism and gifs of the Holy Spirit. [This happened]
The second move of the Holy Spirit will result in people leaving historic churches and planting new churches. [This happened]
In the duration of each of these moves, the people who are involved will say ‘This is the great revival’. But the Lord says ‘No’, neither is this the great revival but both are steps towards it.



Word and Spirit
When the new church phase is on the wane, there will be evidenced in the churches something that has not been seen before: a coming together of those with an emphasis on the Word and those with an emphasis on the Spirit.
When the Word and the Spirit come together, there will be the biggest movement of the Holy Spirit that the nation, and indeed the world, has ever seen. It will mark the beginning of a revival that will eclipse anything that has been witnessed within these shores, even the Wesleyan and the Welsh revivals of former years. The outpouring of God’s Spirit will flow over from the UK to the mainland of Europe, and from there will begin a missionary move to the ends of the earth.”


[This Great Revival of Church Unity is widely anticipated …! ]



A Prophecy for Great Britain - given to the recognised Prophet Wendy Alec, who has borne much fruit (Deuteronomy 17: 18-22, Matthew.7:17) – the co-founder of God TV, which broadcasts Christian teaching to over 200 nations across the World, and which started in Britain.


(Excerpt from: Vision for Great Britain 2005 – Wendy Alec http://www.elijahlist.com/words/display_word/3247 )

“And then I saw that some kind of NET was being loosed from the heavenlies down to earth. And I heard the Lord say, "THIS IS THE SNARE OF HEAVEN." And I saw a great angelic host . . . the warring host of Heaven being dispatched across Great Britain and Europe and other Northern-most and Middle-Eastern parts of the earth, with swords that glistened like flaming fires. And the Lord said, "As in the ancient of times, so as My people humble themselves and pray, a great and mighty roar of battle shall be unleashed from the heavenlies, and My mighty warring angels shall go forth, for I shall send them from the North and from the South."



“And the Lord said, "Because of the heartfelt prayers of My saints, I shall send my Angelic Host and the sound of their battle cry shall resound through the four corners of the earth as they prepare to meet the Princes of Darkness.


The Great Joining and New Power for Evangelism – prophecy

(Wendy Alec – ‘Journal of the Unknown Prophet – A visitation of Jesus Christ’ 2005)

And so it is that there will come in this end season a great joining of My shepherds. For in this day and in this hour there shall occur a great joining of My pastors across the cities of the Earth – a great joining across the denominations of the earth – a great joining across the nations of the Earth.For it is in this day and it is in this hour that the spirit of disunity, the spirit of territorialism, the spirit of competition, the spirit of selfish ambition shall be exposed in the hearts of My Church and so shall rise My true shepherds. They shall come forth with a rod of wisdom and the rod of grace; they shall do all things for my sake and for the sake of My Kingdom. And so shall the witches and the warlocks tremble with the region of the damned. For surely it is the Great Joining they fear – it is the deathblow to the prince of Division himself.” 



John 13:34,35 I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.'


Those who claim to be Christian but in practice, resist God’s moves towards uniting His Mystical Body at this time - firstly by removing the barriers between His people and then uniting our hearts despite our diversity (See the page ‘A Call for Unity’ on this website) - are placing themselves in a very dangerous place as you will read below about Stumbling Blocks.


John 13:34,35 'I give you a new Commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.'


The Judgement of the Stumbling Blocks.


Let none of us be found to be Stumbling Blocks for other Christians who also love Jesus, since the penalty is severe:


Mark 9:38-43 “John said to Him, Teacher, we saw a man who does not follow along with us driving out demons in Your name, and we forbade him to do it, because he is not one of our band [of Your disciples]. But Jesus said, Do not restrain or hinder or forbid him; for no one who does a mighty work in My name will soon afterward be able to speak evil of Me.  For he who is not against us is for us. [Num. 11:27-29.]  For I tell you truly, whoever gives you a cup of water to drink because you belong to and bear the name of Christ will by no means fail to get his reward. And whoever causes one of these little ones (these believers) who acknowledge and cleave to Me to stumble and sin, it would be better (more profitable and wholesome) for him if a [huge] millstone were hung about his neck, and he were thrown into the sea.  And if your hand puts a stumbling block before you and causes you to sin, cut it off! It is more profitable and wholesome for you to go into life [that is really worthwhile] maimed than with two hands to go to hell (Gehenna), into the fire that cannot be put out.” (AMP)


Attacking God’s Children – Judgement of the Stumbling Blocks



Rick Joyner is an evangelical pastor, with a highly respected prophetic ministry in the Body of Christ and he experienced a profound vision during which he observed a recently deceased contemporary who was in the lowest rank of Heaven:


Rick Joyner – ‘The Final Quest’
p.108-9



[Contemporary] “I became the worst thing a man can become on the earth – a stumbling block who produced other stumbling blocks. We sowed fear and division throughout the church, all in the name of protecting the truth. In my self-righteousness I was headed for perdition. In his great mercy the Lord allowed me to be struck by a disease that would bring about a slow and humiliating death. Just before my death I came to my senses and repented. I am just thankful to be here at all.”


[Joyner] I recalled how I had allowed disgruntled former members of a church to spread their poison about that church without stopping them. I knew that by allowing them to do this without correcting them I had encouraged them to continue. I remember thinking that this was justified because of the errors of that church. I then began to remember how I had even repeated many of their stories, justifying it under the guise of enlisting prayers for them. Soon a great flood of other such incidents began to arise in my heart. Again, I was starting to be overwhelmed by the evil and darkness of my own soul.



[Contemporary] “And we always comforted ourselves by actually thinking that we were doing God a favour when we attacked His own children….It is good for you to see this here, because you can go back. Please warn my disciples of their impending doom if they do not repent. Many of them are called to be kings here, but if they do not repent they will face the worse judgement of all – the judgement of the stumbling blocks. My humbling disease was grace from God. When I stood before the throne I asked the Lord to send such grace to my disciples. I cannot cross back over to them, but He has allowed me this time with you. Please forgive and release those who have attacked you. They really do not understand that they are doing the work of the Accuser.”


A Word for Catholics


It is an unquestioned historical fact, that at the time of the Reformation (1517 >) there was widespread call for reform across the Laity, abuse of popular devotions and worldliness in the Catholic Church, indeed surely many of today’s Catholics would also have ‘protested’ and become ‘Protestants’ at that time. Those who actually ‘protested’ and eventually found themselves outside of the Catholic Church were left with few historical foundations to rely upon to find the ‘truth’ of the gospel, except ironically, the Catholic doctrine of the Divine inspiration of Scripture. This doctrine from 2 Timothy 3:16 stated that every word of ‘the Bible’ (which had been composed by the Catholic Church) is deliberate and inspired by God.


Without a central interpreting authority that they felt they could trust, Protestants were obliged to rely on ‘private interpretation’ of the Scriptures, even allowing themselves the liberty to leave out some books from the long established Bible canon. Obviously, this caused subsequent division amongst the Protestant Christians as one person disagreed with the interpretation of another and set up a yet another Church.



Recognising the 500 year faithful journey of integrity and division that the Protestant Christians have experienced in their pursuit of ‘truth’, Catholics must be loving and respectful of the different viewpoints of our separated brothers and sisters. God seems to have been working in the different fruit and development of different talents in the Christian Church in subtle ways as a result.

(Lumen Gentium – Second Vatican Council 1964)

“15. The Church recognizes that in many ways she is linked with those who, being baptized, are honored with the name of Christian…. Likewise we can say that in some real way they are joined with us in the Holy Spirit, for to them too He gives His gifts and graces whereby He is operative among them…. In all of Christ's disciples the Spirit arouses the desire to be peacefully united, in the manner determined by Christ … Mother Church never ceases to pray, hope and work that this may come about.” 



Timothy (2 Timothy 3:16) says that Scripture is good for correcting error and therefore the Protestant Churches through history have applied a critical protection of sorts to the Catholic Church from further corruption or excesses, at considerable cost to themselves.


Respect not Conversion
It is not our intention to convert Protestants to believe or agree with Catholic teaching, but to demonstrate and reassure any Protestant reader of the intellectual integrity of the Catholic Church’s interpretation of Holy Scripture, and particularly on these pages, the Catholic understanding of the role of the Virgin Mary – “the handmaid of the Lord “ in God’s plans for mankind.
We hope that to demonstrate that each of the respective Catholic beliefs about the Virgin Mary is rooted in the Bible and Christ-centred is a valid biblical interpretation for the Catholic Church to make, which our Protestant brothers and sisters should be able to respect.

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Essentially this ‘Counterfeit grace’ message is believing that God is so loving and forgiving that you can stay in your sinful habits because He will understand - that a loving, kind and good God would never condemn a person to the lake of fire. This is unscriptural. For Catholics, since the Second Vatican Council, there has been a swing away from being petrified of a stern God who is hyper-aware of your sins and demands fasting and penance or you’re in big trouble. This is good because our loving God desires us to love Him in return and not fear Him. However, it is possible to over-swing in the other direction and presume that God is like a foolish parent who will not discipline us, nor is He capable of sending us to Hell. Yes God is forgiving of everything and all understanding of our weaknesses – but the condition for forgiveness is repentance and asking for forgiveness. To sin without repentance is to play with damnation. In the Protestant camp, the Calvinist teaching of perpetual salvation: that once a person is saved, he cannot lose his salvation no matter what sins he may subsequently commit, has been steadily losing support over past decades amongst Protestants, with even Calvinists being rather embarrassed by it, realising that a Christian can indeed go to Hell, as the Bible points out; Romans 11:22 'Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity towards those who have fallen, but God's kindness towards you, provided you continue in his kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off'. Matthew 7:21-23 'Not everyone who says to me, "Lord, Lord", will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only one who does the will of my Father in heaven. On that day many will say to me, "Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many deeds of power in your name?" Then I will declare to them, "I never knew you; go away from me, you evildoers." 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For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do: by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and to deal with sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, so that the just requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit. To set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace'. Therefore, for anyone to live in a state of unrepented sin like e.g. pornography, envy, greed, anger or gossip, etc. is to set our minds on things of the flesh and to experience a death. Despite Catholics’ greater awareness of sin, taught to them as children and the need for repentance in order to fully receive Grace, similarly too the Catholic Church is losing a sense of sin, and has seen a massive reduction in attendance at the sacrament of Confession (also called ‘Reconciliation’). It is also clear that the vast majority of Catholics attending mass, routinely receive Holy Communion – when, because the confessionals are virtually empty, they may not be in a state of grace (as Catholic teaching calls it). Again, this is a Counterfeit Grace message, causing a dulling of the awareness of personal sin, and repentance is so often overlooked. Interestingly, according to the Bible, many Catholics may be experiencing sickness or worse, as a result of still receiving Communion when in a state of sin: 1 Corinthians 11:27-30 ' Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be answerable for the body and blood of the Lord. Examine yourselves, and only then eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For all who eat and drink without discerning the body, eat and drink judgement against themselves. For this reason many of you are weak and ill, and some have died.' Protestants have little apparent understanding of the theology of Grace, and so they have been more easily misled into a message of ‘Counterfeit Grace’, as Tony Kemp has highlighted. But for Catholics, who are well versed in the ‘law of Grace’ : whereby God cannot abide with sin and so we must repent if we are in any grave sin – or we will live without God abiding in us, and to die in that state means we will go to Hell. This is the ‘law of Grace’ – how Grace works! - wonderful and forgiving as God is, repentance for our sins is an essential requirement – and when we are in a state free of grave sin, we are again open for Grace to pour into our lives. 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The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy and peace – who doesn’t want that in a world full of stress and panic attacks? Don’t wait, just repent!! Galatians 5:22,23 ' By contrast, the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control.' Insecurity and Inferiority - Another Secret Strategy of Satan In his book ‘Satan’s Dirty Little Secret’, Pastor Steve Foss shares a profound and very interesting prophetic vision given to him, in which he was shown the deep, deep roots, which allow the many and varied demons which torment people with persistent sin, to resist spiritual warfare and direct prayer against them. These roots are two-fold – Insecurity and Inferiority. Insecurity and Inferiority are the doorways through which every other spirit gets it entrance and manitains it hold. Insecurity is experienced when the foundations which we base our lives and beliefs on, seem to be discredited; and inferiority comes when we measure ourselves against others and to see our relative inadequacy in relation to them. These two attitudes of mind, also caused the original fall of Adam and Eve and are still widespread and extremely effective today. http://www.stevefoss.com Pastor Steve Foss elaborates the implications of this insight in considerable detail, including highlighting the advertising and entertainment media deliberately provoking inferiority to cause us to buy products; and expensive lifestyles, cars, houses with big mortgage payments, keeping us insecure from debt and money-centeredness. 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It is not unusual in the United Kingdom for the test question to be put: “Would you have said that if the person was not a woman? – or man - as appropriate?”. Why this political correctness is such a damaging lie for everyone, is that if we are insisting that everyone IS the same, and so by definition - denying the positivity of the differences and diversity between us – the effect is that when we then look at other people who are more gifted in this or that area of talent and diversity, we inevitably feel inferior and insecure in the comparison. The opposite would be to be very aware of our diversity, to celebrate it, and even if another person has strengths I do not have, I am confident that I have strengths that they don’t have too – and we can all respect and appreciate each other in diversity. A modern parable, would be like the sibling who realises that his sister is much better at science than he is, who may then feel low self esteem as a result - but the wise parent will point out the fact that he is better than his sister at art and languages, so everyone’s self esteem and mutual appreciation is encouraged. Women and men are equal but certainly not the same – what a joke! Who is it that is sweeping us all into this insistence on ‘sameness’, when our diversity is so obvious that it should be appreciated and embraced? Ephesians 4:14 'We must no longer be children, tossed to and fro and blown about by every wind of doctrine, by people's trickery, by their craftiness in deceitful scheming.' Even if the average person in the world doesn’t know who or what they are, this should not be so for us Christians. We do know that we were all uniquely created by a loving Father God, in His image and likeness – and we can undo our inferiority and insecurity by embracing our uniqueness and trusting our dear loving Daddy (Abba) God more and more strongly. Indeed, in Rick Joyner’s vision, it is when Christians come to know the unconditional love of the Father, that they are strongest and most resistant to the arrows and tricks of Satan. http://www.morningstarministries.org The accusation of heresy As something of a Post-script, it may be constructive to make a comment about the word ‘heresy’. In history, the word ‘heresy’ has been used as if it were the most terrible of all sins, and indeed many people were burned at the stake for committing this offence, by all sides. The Catholic Church, particularly, has been rigid in determining and guarding historical truths and interpretations that it feels have been handed down to it, and why heresy is such an important word in that context. In the history of the Catholic Church, much has been made of the word ‘heresy’ or the labelling of someone as a ‘heretic’. Perhaps the single biggest reason is the Eucharist or Holy Communion in the Catholic Mass. When Jesus taught a large crowd of disciples that if they did not eat His body and drink his blood, they would have no life in them, most Protestants believe that Jesus was speaking figuratively and not literally; that taking communion in ‘The Lord’s Supper’ is a ‘remembering’ of the last supper, and not a spiritual event, consuming the real food and drink of Jesus’ Body. Again, this is not intended to convert Protestants to Catholic beliefs, but only for them to respect that the Catholic position is not unscriptural, but a different interpretation. Let us look again at the Scripture: John 6:51 - 67 'I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats of this bread will live for ever; and the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.' The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, 'How can this man give us his flesh to eat?' So Jesus said to them, 'Very truly, I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Those who eat my flesh and drink my blood have eternal life, and I will raise them up on the last day; for my flesh is true food and my blood is true drink. Those who eat my flesh and drink my blood abide in me, and I in them. Just as the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever eats me will live because of me. This is the bread that came down from heaven, not like that which your ancestors ate, and they died. But the one who eats this bread will live for ever.' He said these things while he was teaching in the synagogue at Capernaum. When many of his disciples heard it, they said, 'This teaching is difficult; who can accept it?' But Jesus, being aware that his disciples were complaining about it, said to them, 'Does this offend you? Then what if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before? It is the spirit that gives life; the flesh is useless. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life. But among you there are some who do not believe.' For Jesus knew from the first who were the ones that did not believe, and who was the one that would betray him. And he said, 'For this reason I have told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted by the Father.' Because of this many of his disciples turned back and no longer went about with him. So Jesus asked the twelve, 'Do you also wish to go away?' Please note that when many of Jesus’ disciples found this teaching intolerable and left him, Jesus did not say “Wait, stop, you have misunderstood me – I was only speaking metaphorically, using symbolism!”. No – Jesus allowed them to leave, he had spoken literally. Similarly today, many non-Catholic Christians have found this teaching unbelievable, although the Lutherans and many Anglicans do believe that the Communion is the real presence of Jesus, and the Catholic Church for 2000 years has certainly held to this belief. This understanding however, comes with a caution: 1 Corinthians 11:27-30 'Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be answerable for the body and blood of the Lord. Examine yourselves, and only then eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For all who eat and drink without discerning the body, eat and drink judgement against themselves. For this reason many of you are weak and ill, and some have died.' 1 Corinthians 11:29 For whoever eats and drinks from it being unworthy, eats and drinks a guilty verdict into his soul for not distinguishing the body of THE LORD JEHOVAH. Aramaic Bible in Plain English So the Catholic Church holds strongly to this interpretation, (borne out by several well documented miracles – where a consecrated bread host has turned into real cardiac muscle) that the bread and wine of the Lord’s Supper actually becomes the Real Body and Blood of Jesus. (This Biblical caution is also the loving and protective reason why Catholics resist Protestants from receiving the Eucharist in Catholic services – so that their action will not bring condemnation upon themselves.) As a consideration: if a Protestant minister had a sliver of bread on his kitchen table which was the real Body of Jesus – what would he do; how would he conduct himself; would there be a certain way that he should proceed? After all, we recall what happened to Uzzah: 2 Samuel 6:7 'The anger of the LORD was kindled against Uzzah; and God struck him there because he reached out his hand to the ark; and he died there beside the ark of God.' Well this is the situation within the Catholic Church, and after the historical model of the Levitical priests, who were specially selected, trained and performed a definite ritual to enter the Holy of Holies in the Old Testament; similarly to show due reverence to the presence of Jesus in their Communion Service, Catholics have specially prepared priests, who undergo set rituals in preparing and approaching the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist. Though Protestants may not believe this, Catholics do. Now placed in such a position: of on one hand believing the Real Presence of Jesus to be present in the elements of the Lord’s Supper, and also being aware of the strict caution not to approach these elements unworthily or they will bring condemnation on themselves – the Catholic Church has been obliged to remain very close to it’s original and historical traditions. Therefore, the Catholic Church feels it has had valid reason to be robust in its defence of the truths that it has received through history. It has at times been severe with those who hold to different views – the definition of ‘heresy’ is ‘a belief or opinion contrary to orthodox religious doctrine’. (Concise Oxford Dictionary) On the other hand, Protestants have been free to ‘do Church’ in diverse styles and ways since they left the Catholic Church, even if they may also be missing something that the Catholic Church holds very dear in the Eucharist. Brothers and Sisters, let us pray not to be deceived again into hating each other just because of diversity and differences, which are allowed by God for His purposes. Indeed, when the thousands of different Christian denominations recognise with love and respect, the beauty of the diversity which God has arranged and allowed in His Mystical Body the Church, united in love and mutual respect – then we will be able to also bring the Nations of the World to also recognise their respective strengths and talents and be united in Love. 1 John 4:7,8 'Beloved, let us love one another, because love is from God; everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love does not know God, for God is love.'

Purification of Memory – The 'Reformation Divorce'

By Webmaster • July 17, 2024
John Wayne and Lee Marvin play characters in the film Donovan’s Reef, who relapse into fighting whenever they see each other – predictably every year for decades. And the daughter of one of them points out that they have been fighting so long, they have forgotten what they were fighting about in the first place, so they can never make up and be friends. There seems something of that dynamic between the Catholic Christians and Protestant Christians – we’ve forgotten what we originally disagreed about .... Corruption in the Catholic Church Regrettably, the breakdown of relations between the Catholic Church and the Reformers (who had understandably protested about the unquestioned corruption within the Catholic Church at that time) was very unpleasant and destructive – with scars remaining until this day - like a very unpleasant and bitter divorce. (But we know that bitterness has unforgiveness at its root .... and the Lord's Prayer mentions forgiveness as a condition for receiving God's Grace!!). It is a well-documented and unquestioned historical fact, that at the time of the Reformation there was widespread corruption, abuse of power and ‘worldliness’ in the Catholic Church, and no doubt many of today’s Catholics would also have ‘protested’ and become ‘Protestants’ at that time. When the Pope at that time, responded defiantly to the protesters, those conscientious reformers eventually found themselves outside the Catholic Church and subsequently formed the Protestant Churches, where they have continued to test and ironically 'protect'; their parent organisation - the Roman Catholic Church ever since: As Timothy (2Timothy.3:16) states, Scripture is good for correcting error and as such the so called 'Bible-based' Churches have been rather a protection for the Catholic Church in their challenges and debate. Scripture scholarship amongst Protestants is highly respected by Catholic theologians who of course, also have their own Scripture scholars. (The Bible, as a large collection of separate books by different authors, was of course discerned and composed by the Catholic Church in the first place.) Indulgences Leading up to the Reformation it is not difficult to see God’s purposes in the Protestants ‘protesting’ about what the newly available printed Bible told them was wrong in the conduct of the Catholic Church at that time - having become corrupted by land ownership; involvement in politics; untrained clergy who were doing a "job" and not following a "calling"; and also many superstitious practices had developed, which were a distraction from true faith. The last straw was when the Pope Leo X, who was perhaps one of the most extravagant and worldly Popes in history, decided to renovate St Peter’s basilica in Rome, and to acquire the enormous sums of money for renovation, he encouraged the sale of "Indulgences," which was a promise of relief from eternal penalties. As a result, over-zealous clergy wandered the Continent encouraging and pressuring the poor to give money they couldn’t afford, for fear of their loved ones suffering longer in Purgatory than they otherwise might. In Germany this over-zealous practice aroused the frustration of Martin Luther, a Catholic monk, who, in 1517 issued ninety-five arguments (theses) suggesting reform of the Catholic Church – many of them aimed at attacking the doctrine of indulgences which was being abused and he also resented the related doctrine of Purgatory – a place of final cleansing of lesser sins (purging) before entering Heaven. Luther wrote in his 95 Theses criticising the Church, - "Why doesn't the Pope build the basilica of St Peter's out of his own money?" What Luther did was very timely, since there were numerous other factors, like a "perfect storm" which ignited at the spark which he provided – the Church was ripe for reform. German nobles saw an opportunity to cut off currency flowing to Rome which was very much needed at home, so they backed Luther's cause and Europe started to unravel into regional wars due to the combination of political interests and religious zeal.. In 1520, Leo issued the papal bull "Exsurge Domine" demanding Luther retract 41 of his 95 theses, and after Luther's refusal, excommunicated him. (Interesting that out of 95 theses, the Pope only asked him to retract 41 of them – leaving 54 that were presumably valid concerns.) Anyway, the papacy at that time was defiant and unrepentant, and eventually, after decades of ‘Protesting’, the initial reformers, whose intention had not been to leave the Catholic Church originally, but only to reform it from within, (and whose authority in doing so was reference to the newly printed Bible), ended up being excommunicated by the Vatican and left to fend for themselves. Indeed non-Catholic Christians were denounced and ‘going to Hell’, as far as the Catholic Church believed,for the next 450 years -Though there had been a longstanding debate within the Catholic Church about the salvation of non-Catholic Christians; also unbaptised babies and adults who had not heard the Gospel so had an excuse not to become Catholics, were not viewed so harshly. Finding themselves outside the Catholic Church, and therefore without the particular interpretation of the Bible that had been handed down to the Catholic Church by the early Christians, the Protestants ‘started from scratch’ - looking at the Bible and interpreting it themselves, which caused inevitable divergence from the original teaching of the Catholic Church and subsequent diversity even within their own numbers. For the Catholic Church’s part, although reforms were actually carried out following the Reformation and corruption undone, the Catholic Church fiercely defended their key truths, that had been handed down through history as Sacred Tradition (solemnly discerned God-inspired Sacred Tradition – note the capital ‘T’ in the word 'Tradition'). Looking around the Christian denominations at present, it is easy to recognise different talents, styles and emphases in the different denominations and ministries; some are more evangelising; some more contemplative; some are more attractive to young people; some are more attractive to older people; some are more involved in Social Action than others, etc. God is surely active in this diversity, which God clearly enjoys in Nature too, and which the Protestants particularly have been rather free to develop since they were not bound to the emphasis and solemn liturgy which must accompany the celebration of the Eucharist in the Catholic celebration of Holy Mass. Separated Brothers In the years since the Reformation the Catholic Church continued to teach for centuries, that anyone outside the Catholic Church could not obtain salvation and were therefore going to Hell. Considering that this stance was completely reversed at the Second Vatican Council in the 1960's, this historical condemnation had been a hurtful and divisive decree to declare against the Protesters, who had after all only opposed the corruption in the Catholic Church, in the first place. On the other hand, holding their measuring rod of the 'Bible-alone' against the Catholic Church, Protestants have also spent centuries denouncing Catholic teachings which vary from theirs in similar harsh and angry terms, insisting that anything not in the Bible cannot be true faith. Both positions have made unity more difficult. During the Council several documents were produced concerned ecumenism and a "unity" with non-Catholic Christians. As a result of those pronouncements, the Catholic Church recognized Christians in the Orthodox and Protestant Churches as "separated brethren" i.e. siblings of the same family who are not together! This was a drastic change from the previous centuries of denunciation that existed between the Catholic Church and other Christian Churches. Catholic and Orthodox Churches have long been very close in their respect for their respective diversity and formal relationships. In his famous ‘Maxims of Christian Perfection for All Christians’, Blessed Antonio Rosmini, who is being made a saint by the Catholic Church because of his exemplary life, wrote (emphases added for clarity): Jesus Christ has power over all things in heaven and on earth, and has merited to be absolute Lord of all people; and He alone, with unspeakable wisdom, power and goodness, rules all events according to His Divine pleasure, and for the greater good of the elect who form His beloved Spouse the Church. Christians therefore should feel perfectly at peace and full of joy, resting entirely upon their Lord, however contrary even to the good of the Church events may seem. But they must not cease from praying earnestly that the will of God may be done on earth as it is in heaven, that is, that people may fulfil the holy law of charity on earth as the saints fulfil it in heaven.” Christians should banish from their hearts all uneasiness, and every kind of anxiety and apprehension, even that which seems at times to have no other object than the good of the Church of Jesus Christ. Moreover, they must not rashly imagine that they can remedy the evils, which assail the Church, before they see clearly that such is the will of the Lord.* They must bear in mind that Jesus Christ alone is the Ruler of His Church, and that most displeasing to Him, and most unworthy of His disciples, is the rashness of those who, not called and moved by Him, but, led blindly by a secret pride, presume of their own accord to do any good in the Church, however little it may be, as if the Divine Redeemer stood in need of their poor help, or of that of any person whatever. (Maxim 3)- http://www.rosminicentre.co.uk/images/witness/MAXIMSPRINTEDBOOKLET.pdf (* The call to unity on this page, has come from a specific prophetic instruction to bring down the barriers between God’s people) God has certainly therefore, allowed the diversity of the Orthodox and the Reformation churches as a major factor in His Mystical Body, the Christian Church “according to His Divine pleasure” – and it would be pride and presumption for any of us to resist and be scornful of this God-given diversity without clear guidance from the Lord. The Catholic Church for its part, has held onto longstanding truths, and has not felt so free to explore different ways of ‘doing Church’ during the centuries. Each denomination has different talents and strengths – we just need, like different members of a corporate team, to respect our differences and not despise them, since the Almighty hand of God is certainly at work in this diversity within His Body. Having quoted from a Catholic saint, for our Protestant brethren let us also consider this positive view of diversity in the Scriptures, where we may also see that God enjoys diversity and expects it in His Church: At the beginning of Jesus’ public ministry in Luke 4:18, it is evident from the text He chooses (Isaiah 61) and his explanation (Luke 4:21-27) that he came to save the poor, the captive, the blind, the oppressed, Jews, and the gentiles. Jesus’ love for all people is clearly evident as the Gospels record numerous examples of his ministry: to a Roman officer (Matthew 8:5-13); a Canaanite woman (Matthew 15:22-28); a Samaritan woman (John 4:7-29), and to the “lost sheep of the house of Israel” (Matthew 10:6). His inclusivity for His Church is demonstrated by reference to the kingdom of heaven being populated by those “from east and west” (Matthew 8:10-12), no doubt a reference to his “other sheep, which are not of this fold” (John 10:16). Yet, Jesus’ desire and plan for these 'last days', is for His diverse followers to “become one flock with one shepherd” (John 10:16), “perfected in unity” as proof to the world that He was sent by God (John 17:10-26). The answer to divisions in the Church is the cross by which Jesus reconciled all things who were once hostile to himself (Colossians 1:19-21) and brought peace out of the hostility that once existed between us: Colossians 1:19 -22: For in him all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell, and through him God was pleased to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, by making peace through the blood of his cross. And you who were once estranged and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds, he has now reconciled in his fleshly body through death. Of course we also have Jesus in the Book of Revelation describing several diverse attributes of the seven Churches which he refers to positively, as well as the areas of criticism that were also mentioned. adly within 30 years of the Reformation starting, the Anabaptists insisted that the other reformers (Lutherans and Calvinists etc.) were not even Christian because they were baptised as infants (cf. infant circumcision and entry into covenant on the eighth day after birth), and Protestants began executing other Protestants over doctrinal differences according to the particular creed held to by the judiciary in respective towns and regions. The Catholics of the time were equally hostile against Protestants. In hindsight, all sides were unloving and unchristian to other Christians in the name of 'truth', which must have saddened God greatly.. So in terms of ‘purifying our memories’, as referred to by Pope John Paul II, neither the Catholics: who were in a pitiful mess and subsequently excommunicated and damned to Hell their Christian critics for 450 years; nor the Protestants: who have been equally fierce and unforgiving, not just against Catholics but even against each other, should be quick to ‘cast the first stone’ and we must remind ourselves that when we do accuse, we have one finger pointing forward and three fingers pointing back at ourselves. The Orthodox and Catholic Churches have made great progress in reconciling their differences but unfortunately, from the Protestant Churches, there is no single voice who could accept his apology and make courageous and loving steps towards forgiveness and reconciliation as Pope John Paul II did. But let us all now work and prayer to ensure that there are no more obstacles of misunderstanding and unforgiveness between us Christians brothers and sisters.
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